Three Midwest ag economists share insights and predictions | The Spokesman Speaks Podcast, 3-Part Series

The Spokesman Speaks podcast

Welcome to this special 3-part podcast series with three Midwest Farm Bureau economists: Iowa Farm Bureau senior economist Dr. Sam Funk, Nebraska Farm Bureau senior economist Jay Rempe, and Illinois Farm Bureau senior economist Mike Doherty.

Part 1 covers farm income and credit conditions, government assistance, international trade, and more. Part 2 deals with the changing nature of farm production, ownership, and management – as well as the impact of COVID-19. Part 3 dives into changing farm demographics, the impact of consumer and farmland owner preferences on farming practices, how the next generation of farmers is changing things up, and more.

Part 1 (released November 9)


Part 2 (released November 12)


Part 3 (released November 16)


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Narrator: Welcome to the Spokesman Speaks a podcast from Iowa's leading agricultural news source brought to you by the Iowa Farm Bureau. Now here's your host.

Andrew Wheeler: Come to this special November 9th edition of the Spokesman Speaks podcast. I'm Andrew Wheeler and today's episode is the first part of a three-part series that we're bringing to you over the next few weeks. In late October, we brought together three Midwestern Farm Bureau economists, Iowa Farm Bureau, Senior Economist, Dr. Sam Funk, Nebraska Farm Bureau, Senior Economist, Jay Rampy, and Illinois Farm Bureau, Senior Economist, Mike Doherty, who had a robust recording of a virtual meeting that lasted more than an hour. During that discussion, we really drilled into some of their insights into 2020, as well as their predictions. Looking further out into the future. We'll split that discussion into three parts that were released to you over the next couple of weeks. Right now, I actually have Dr. Sam Funk here with me. Now, Sam, it was your idea to bring this group together. Tell us why you thought it was important to do this special series now and at a high level, what you think farmers will gain from this discussion.

Dr. Sam Funk: Well, glad to be here with you, Andrew, you know, part of the aspect of having the three economists from these Midwestern states come together is really just to kind of show what things are similar amongst our states and what are different. As we look at trying to bring this information together with several of the topics there'll be raised in these podcasts, how our different states that our members view these and what do we do as economist, or to address certain issues that arise day-to-day or sometimes in a very unique fashion, such as we'll see with COVID.

Andrew Wheeler: Now this podcast series is actually a precursor for a larger webinar series that you're planning for farmers in 2021. Why don't you tell us about that and where farmers can go to stay tuned for the details? Dr. Sam Funk: Sure. So, normally we would have, in-person an IFB Economic Summit. This year, obviously COVID put a crimp on a lot of plans that we have as an organization and obviously in our day-to-day living. So, if we think about what we wanted to do, we still want to get some very high level information out for our members to be able to understand what that current leading edge economic thought is and bring it out through there. So, what we want to do is coming into the beginning part of 2021 is to actually have the IFBF Economic Summit Webinar Series. And so that webinar will actually have a video presentation that people will be able to log on and be able to provide questions while we're going through that. And also then view the recorded webinar later on as they might want to. So, where is that one going to be coming up? Well, I think for one thing, we'll have it mentioned again on some of these podcasts with the Spokesman Speaks. There'll probably be articles coming out with the Spokesman and then we'll actually put a lot of that information when all the dates and times are known for these webinars series, we'll put that on So, people can obviously go to the website and be able to see when those events are going to take place. But we anticipate just with some of the speakers we've already lined up, it'll be some very interesting topics that many of our farm families will be interested in being able to attend those webinars virtually and get that information.

Andrew Wheeler: Well, we'll definitely look forward to that upcoming webinars series, which our listeners will be hearing a lot more about in this podcast, in the Spokesman newspaper and on our website as we inch closer to 2021. And Sam, thanks for pulling this group of economists together. I know our listeners really appreciate their expert insight.

Dr. Sam Funk: You know, it's always one of those great things to be able to bring good people together, to hear from them. And I think there's going to be a lot information that our members and others are going to be able to hear through these podcasts for just if you get three economists together from these Midwestern State Farm Bureaus, what do we think about and where do some of our topics range when we get into these deeper discussions?

Andrew Wheeler: All right, let's get to it. Spokesman editor Dirck Steimel takes it from here.

Dirck Steimel: We're here with Sam Funk, Senior Economist with the Iowa Farm Bureau Federation and two of his counterparts from neighboring states, Jay Rampy, economist with the Nebraska Farm Bureau and Mike Doherty from the Illinois Farm Bureau. Today, we're going to discuss the state of the Midwest farm economy and the economic outlook for farmers as we head into 2021. Let's talk first about the farm income outlook in each of your states. Let's move West to East and we'll start with you, Jay.

Jay Rampy: Well, thank you, Dirck, and thank you for the opportunity to be here today. I certainly appreciate that and appreciate appearing with, with Sam and Mike and, and I I'm sure I'll learn something out of this discussion today as well. At Nebraska actually considering COVID and everything that the captain to do 2020 things are looking fairly decent right now in terms of farm income. The latest numbers or projections that we've seen projected increase in farming income this year. We may hit close to $6 billion in net farm income. Last year, we had a USDA estimated about a 4.2 billion net farm income in the state of Nebraska. And so we're seeing the increase in there's a couple of reasons for that. I think one is the higher commodity prices that we've had here in the last few months, and that certainly will help with the crop receipts. And then in the livestock receipts, most of if tradition or history holds, most of our crop is marketed from September through December of the year, or at least 43% of it is and so we should see some higher receipts out of that. But then the government assistance that we saw seen out of COVID is, has been a big, big thing too, as well for farm income. At the farm level, it's been a little bit, I call it the kind of the tale of two farms where I think we have a cohort of farmers that are doing well. They're keeping their costs and their control. They're managing things. And they're able to break even, or see positive returns out of even the commodity prices that we've seen this year. But then we have another segment that I think is really struggling. They came into the year working capital, they burned through, they are, they're having trouble meeting their short-term debts. And, and so it's kind of a tale of two different farms there, if you will. I think the Kevin of assistance this year is helping those on the low end managed through that this year. I'm a little concerned what 2021 might mean for them in terms of trying to, to generate some farm income, some positive returns given the level of commodity prices. But I think we'll have to see commodity prices go up a little more for them to see some positive returns, but overall setting right now I'm feeling a lot better and a lot more positive about where we're standing at this point. Then I would have said four or five months ago. That's for sure.

Dirck Steimel: Sam, what's your take on the outlook in Iowa?

Dr. Sam Funk: You know, I think the Jay brings up a lot of really good points and it's, you know, the tale of two farms I think is a great way to phrase it, but you've always got that pressure out through there. And I think it's a matter of timing for a lot of people. I mean, obviously 2020 was just an extremely challenging year. Everybody knows COVID was such a big driver. And so if I was a livestock producer through the earlier portions of COVID and didn't necessarily get to market all of my pigs, maybe I had some difficulty getting my cattle marketed out through the state. This was a really challenging year. And I think farm income for some of these producers and will show that it was a challenging year for some it'll, it'll be significant moving on even into next year, trying to recoup some of those losses on what to take in place this year. So, I think it's a matter of that, that timing aspect. If, if on the other hand I happened to be one of those producers who still had some soy beans that had marketed yet. And after these prices started to take their strides toward these multi-year highs here recently, I might feel really good. The farm income situation for me could be a completely one 80 from what I fear that it might've been because I've got a lot more market opportunity to be able to market that crop. So, you know, that's one of those aspects that, you know, if you could have projected that, we'd be having futures prices for soybeans that on the nearby contract would put us up in the, you know, 10.90 range. And if you would've thought that I could market beans directly from the field for close to $10 in several areas around Iowa boy, you were, you were a stronger marketer than most other is around there. You know, and this is on the tail of, you know, after we had phase one, and even though we had phase one agreement in place with China buying you know, all of these agricultural commodities that were scheduled to go out, but we didn't see prices increase for quite some time afterwards. So, I think it's a, it's a, it's a very much this, you know, the tale of two farms I think works or the tale of what time you know, what, what situations I find myself in there would be some producers out there maybe who had an investment in some of those pig barns. They may not actually have another loop pigs coming back in to fill up those barns. So, there's a wide variety of challenges which could take place. And, you know, we could talk about the aggregate numbers through there and how that comes to place. I think there were a lot of programs people could avail themselves to, but the farm income situation, I think will be very individualized for what does it mean to each individual farmer? In what situation they're going to face.

Dirck Steimel: Mike, how about on your side, the river?

Mike Doherty: Well Sam and Jay have really captured it well, a lot of the dynamics and they apply here to Illinois as well. However, there's some differences Illinois is much more grain dependent, corn and soybean rotation is 80% of our revenues, which is higher percentage than in Iowa or Nebraska, where they have more livestock. So, we're very sensitive here in Illinois, as far as overall farm income to those corn and soybean prices. And yes, to Sam's point. This has been a phenomenal turnaround late in the season. Something we rarely see with these cash soybean prices currently at around $10, 50 cents, a bushel here in central Illinois. And that is going to result in the highest net farm income for corn and soybean rotation since 2013. So, that's a good, the good news. And that was unexpected. On the other hand, we also have pretty much the same level of debt leveraging and working capital constraints and low working capital that we had liquidity levels being low that we had going into this year, that tier of farmers, according to the economic research has been done. Some of it I've reviewed that was done by Iowa State. It was excellent shows that the farmers who through the last five to seven years had tight liquidity, high debt to their asset levels, and on the verge of, or experiencing credit problems in terms of loan repayment, they will probably continue to have those problems going into 2021. The only difference is that they, that the ones that might've completely capsized will have maybe been saved by the high soybean prices. So, that speaks to what Jay is talking about, about tale of two farms. You've got the ones that came into this year, financially stressed, and they're going to largely, still be somewhat stressed going into 2021. And then you've got the other ones that were not all that stressed. And for them, these high soybean prices are really going to help their bottom line and, and hopefully really maybe even increase a little bit of their working capital.

Dirck Steimel: Thanks, Mike. Now let's think a little bit about farm credit conditions. Are there signals are of any issues that lenders are seeing as farmers get ready to talk to their lenders about loans for 2021, Jay, you got any, do you have a feel for that?

Jay Rampy: Yeah, you know, it's kind of interesting because coming into the year again, that we were seeing some signals that were a little troubling in the way of farm credit overall debt was going up, was growing our farm business association here in the state, showed that in their membership, a debt has increased over 40% over the last five years. And then we saw some creeping up of the loan repayment rates in terms of default on those repayments and some other signs out there that, that were just kind of a setting that we're seeing some more problems here. And then for Nebraska, unfortunately through at least the first half of this year, if you look from June 30th to the year prior, we had the second highest number of farm bankruptcies in the nation only behind Wisconsin. And I think Wisconsin's is related to the dairy industry there. I'm not sure exactly what's driving Nebraska's in that regard. Although I will say, I know Sam and Mike and their states, the Midwest we've, we've seen higher bankruptcy rates and relative to the rest of the country. So, at coming into the year as a little bit troubling, I did see some reports here in the last week or so that saying that the amount of loans is, is slowing down a little bit or the debt levels are slowing down a little bit and that they think that's an indication of both of the higher commodity prices and some of the government assistance programs. So, maybe we're kind of stabilized a little bit in that regard. And we've got a bit of a timeout in terms of where we're going to head from now on, but it's been, as Mike alluded to some of those debt to asset ratios and some of the other things we've been slowly creeping and getting worse over time and having some troubling trends. Now, when you look at historically, at least in Nebraska, we're still below where we've been in some, in some really troubling times, but still you'd hate to see those trends the way they were going.

Dirck Steimel: Mike, do you see the same issues there in Illinois?

Mike Doherty: Yes. So, in fact, we got a breakout on this from the Chicago Federal Reserve Bank. They do an index on loans that are either in or severe repayment issue status. And we found that in that analysis that the percentage of those loans in either major or severe repayment status issues that percentage doubled between second quarter of 2019 and the second quarter of 2020 and it's quite strong almost 12, 13% of all farm loans in the Western and Northern Northwestern part of Illinois. Now, the question is how much will those higher soybean prices help those troubled loans on those farms? We don't know. And the other thing we don't know is what percentage of those loans were livestock, particularly hog farmers who had suffered with very low hog prices through a good portion of 2020, and are just now starting to make up for that with higher hog prices. So, it's yet to be seen how this will wash out for 2021, but that measurement, that index of repayment issues with either major or severe repayment issues for loans in Illinois has been increasing every year, according to that analysis by the Chicago Federal Reserve over the past five years. So, so yeah, so it's, it's definitely a concern. We're also hearing a lot about the hog farmers that, that we'll wait and see how they come out at the end of this year. They are expected to show quite a bit of financial stress because of those low hog prices earlier.

Dirck Steimel: Sam, lot of hogs here in Iowa. How to farm credit conditions look here?

Dr. Sam Funk: It's obviously been one of these aspects that it's not just because of COVID that we've had these farm income aspects, which have spilled over into some credit conditions that haven't been favorable. We are in, in Iowa, we're actually in the Chicago Federal Reserve district as well. And so not just looking state by state, but in the whole district out through here. I mean, we've got those farms that are as Mike had alluded to in that difficult situation. I mean, we're at the highest we've been since before 2000, as far as for the number of farm loans, which are showing that higher level distress, if you will. So, it's really important that we start to think about really what's been driving that, yes, we've been seeing increasing numbers of farm bankruptcies. Now those farm bankruptcies typically are somebody that they could be looking for a restructuring there's all sorts of different aspects that people use that a farm bankruptcy, the, the code that's out there in order to restructure, maybe gain some foothold to be able to start back. So, there's a lot of things that drive different reasons why you might think about some of those, those numbers out there that out through you know, so it hasn't been a challenge for a lot of people has been a challenge without a doubt. I mean, we're talking about, you know, years now, year on year of lower farm commodity prices, especially for those Midwestern crops and the livestock that we've had in through here with, with some, you know every once in a while, you'll have those blips they'll happen because of some sort of supply in, in some major exporting country in the world that gives some sort of hope to be able to lift up those markets. So, you know, there's a lot of different things that come in through here, and you've seen a lot of folks who have gone into their lenders and they've taken what had been short-term debt and converted it over into some sort of a long-term debt because of borrowing against what had been a very strong land value base that they've got. And when they take those assets and they start to borrow against them, you make what had been a one-year issue. And in order to continue farming, you made it to a multi-year issue. So, it, it's not that it was a wrong move, but it can be a challenging move to work your way back out of that in a lot of different regards, but, you know low cost of money, as far as for a lot of interest rates that hadn't been increasing as much as some might have projected the ability to transport to a land evaluation use that land asset. There's, there's a lot of things that have changed in agriculture and a lot of issues that could come back to potentially need to be worked out of over the next couple of years.

Dirck Steimel: Ad hoc government payments have made up a big share of farm income the last few years, there's a whole alphabet soup of them, MFP, CFAP, CFAP2. Do you believe that farmers are prepared for a reduction in those payments in 2021 and beyond Jay? What do you think?

Jay Rampy: That's been one of the, the trends over the last two or three years that we've been watching, and it kind of concerned me a little bit when you look at the underlying sources of income for farmers and ranchers, and whether the deriving it from the market or the government. And we're seeing here in Nebraska, potentially this year, somewhere between 35 and 40% of the farm net farm income will be government assistance, payments that. So, as we look to next year, I hate to say this, but I don't think the majority of farmers have thought about that yet. They're in the process of trying to get there, their crops out of, get harvest completed and get things taken care of. At this point, I don't see where a lot of them have thought about, okay, what about next year? And how do we cashflow things? And they'll start those conversations with their bankers here, have this year and start having, figuring that out a little bit. Again, I think those, those ones that are, are setting pretty well financially it's not much of a concern them because they got things under control, regardless, it's those on the, on the other end of the scale that have probably it'll tip the balance one way or another, I think next year on, on some things.

Dirck Steimel: Sam, Iowa got the most of those payments the largest share that we've seen of any state. How about a withdrawal of those payments? How will that affect farmers in Iowa?

Dr. Sam Funk: Well, you know, it really depends on what the markets are going to look like going into next year. I mean, I think that's the, you know if you will, that's the a hundred billion dollar question, right? If we have strong markets that are improving for corn and soybeans, and if we see some strength in livestock markets through here for hogs and for cattle and if the dairy markets can decide to say strong, instead of being able to do this Yogo levels out through there, we could have some producers who were able to make substantial gains and be able to improve their financial situation, both with the number of farm lows we see out there as well as building that working capital that Mike had mentioned earlier, and really improving that overall net farm income picture. I mean, if we don't have, COVID slowing down our economy, if we have strong market movements with now that we've got, you know, if China's really going to get to the phase one, if we're going to have USMCA working as we hope it would for exports of agricultural products both to the North and South to Canada and Mexico, if we can continue to keep you know, some high value beef and pork moving to Japan moving into Korea, but all of these countries, I mean, Japan, stage one chorus, which is the U.S. Korean trade agreement. If these things all come to play and we can keep these markets strong and going there is a potential for the export market and the domestic market in order to support farm income through here. And that's what frankly most producers that I know of would like to be able to see those markets continue to ramp up. Now, there's a lot of questions that come into that when we get to what's going to happen with the ethanol markets, what's going to happen with biodiesel, you know, and really where do we go is COVID going to have, you know, this broad sweeping change coming back in here through this fall and into the winter is, is it going to be an issue? Are we going to see people get back and start driving and using more transportation fuel so that we'll have strong demand for corn going to ethanol markets? There's a lot of questions that come up, but right now, at least there's actually some very strong potential and opportunity. And if people would make some marketing plans right now utilizing the futures market, that's out there and available right now, there's potential, lock-in some market-based prices for lease are Ford soy at this point in time, going out into future years.

Dirck Steimel: Mike, I'll go over to you. And let's talk a little bit about international trade, as Sam mentioned. What's the outlook as you see from a, from a crop standpoint, since Illinois is so heavily with crops?

Mike Doherty: Well, it's a, it's a good question. And there's a lot of concern over what that outlook is after about March to April of next year, and to Sam's point, you know, so much depends on how much demand we're going to have for corn and soybeans and what that, and keeping those prices up. There's a scenario that is not very optimistic on that going in, in, into the middle of 2021, when you know that you've got Brazil estimated to expand their soybean acreage by 3% in their plantings over this coming winter, it'll be their summer. And nowadays when they expand soybeans by 3%, they're expanding their Saprina corn crop, right along with it used to be you only worried about the soybean side of that equation. Now you got to worry about the expansion of both corn and soybeans. They are pulling a lot of their corn off and feeding it into new corn fed ethanol plants. However, that means we don't, we lose our ethanol export market to Brazil. So, we've got that potential depressing effect on prices. Probably be somewhere between March to May of next spring for our corn and soybean prices. Then on also at the same time, you could have a curtailing of this China demand about that same time, and they could start picking up those Brazilian supplies. So, we're really quite concerned that there could be a, a sharp ball off in these prices. And you could see that in the futures market, the lack of carry on those contracts, that's what the market's telling us that that's a valid concern. You've also got the long-term trend here to be aware of that our corn and soybean farmers have continued to outproduce demand overall, and that's been much talked about, and this year, yes, we had high prices, but it came with a much lower production than predicted in Iowa. So, Illinois has benefited from that along with a less or a somewhat of a surprise level of demand on the corn side in China. So, that's sort of like getting lucky for a year. What's going to happen next year? If we get back to more normal conditions they have a good crop down in South America and Iowa has a good crop, our biggest competitor, corn, soybeans, domestically. We could end up right back to some pretty low prices. And, and with that some lower farm income.

Dr. Sam Funk: Let me tail in there to Mike's point about thinking about how things have come together. The first thing to do to look for what we expect prices to do, obviously an easy one is to look at CME contracts out there for soybeans and corn. And frankly, right now, for soybeans, it's telling you take that crop to market. Now don't store the soybeans. There is no carry in the market, so there's no premium built in the market for being able to hold it out month. It's saying deliver it now. So, that risk that Mike is talking about with having more production coming out of Brazil, you know, not just that, which that's a physical, tangible risk for production down through there. But the market itself is telling you, bring that crop in and sell it right now. So, that's what basis levels, that's what everything else is telling us. You need to get that crop sold. Now at the same time that we're talking about getting that crop sold the basis levels between what's a typically higher basis for us here in Iowa, along that Mississippi river. And now we see that we're getting strength into the basis level in the interior of Iowa. And that's partly even for corn, because they're saying, you know what, we can't let all of our corn go down the river to export. We need to have that corn here in the state to be able to fuel our ethanol production and to be able to feed to those livestock. So, there there's a lot of changes they're telling us, but it doesn't say don't market it. It says you can market it by the way, we're going to be part of it just to stay right here. So, there, there's a very strong market signal. Now let's talk about some of the things that are driving. Some of these shifts out through here. And I made this comment just a couple of months ago where I had graphics that looked at how many soybeans that China was getting out of Brazil. Even though we have the phase one agreement. If you were to look at it they were buying so many soybeans out of Brazil to head toward China. They are either one having more hog production after ASF and the devastation to the largest swine herd in the world, which exists in China and still does they've either recovered from that and they need more feed or they're building up strategic store houses again, which they've been known to have multi years’ worth of storage for crops like soybeans in China. And just, you know, that already seen a lot of our corn, and they usually take a lot of sorghum as well. So, China's rebuilding a lot of that demand. And then not only did they drive up prices in Brazil, guess what? They're driving up prices for the United States continue to take exports out of here as well. So, it is a very important aspect that right now the markets are fresh. The markets are calling for our brains our oil seeds. So, we need to fill those up and take advantage of what some potential, maybe even for out years, to be able to lock in some more favorable prices that we've seen for quite some time. So, it's important that we put in a marketing structure right now to look at that plan for not just the immediate, but also going off into the future. And it can be difficult to do, to think about right when we're still in the middle of, you know, a very busy harvest season, but it's important that we do such now will Brazil bring more grain in? The next question is they've got the beginnings of a La Nemea weather pattern and they could be dry. They have been dry. So, could they have some planning difficulties, maybe what we get as a one year reprieve to this whole thing that we've got this marketing year that we can be able to move stuff. You know what that one year preview something we need to mark it off of and be able to, you know, give ourselves some room so that we continue to operate with our farms here. So, it's important that we consider all these aspects but longer term Mike's exactly right. I mean, we just had our market study trip from Iowa Farm Bureau and Dirck. You went on that trip with us in the middle of Brazil and to Mato Grosso. And we know they have more productive capacity to bring online, and those could be longer term strategic challenges for us. So, we already saw this last year that Brazil shipped three times more corn to Mexico than what they had prior. Guess what Mexico is our number one core market. We sure don't want to lose that. Do we Jay? I mean, it's important that we, we have that access to that export market potential, because again, Mike mentioned it we will outproduce the market in most times, and then it's a matter of, do you want to depend on somebody having a strategic production fall back in order to have market stability? That's not market stability, that's more market risk with what's taking place. So, what we've got is more production taking place across the globe, trying to get those export markets. Now we're blessed with a very strong domestic market, a lot of feed utilization. You're welcome, Mike your producers in Illinois. We're glad that we're able to feed that to a lot of birds. We're glad we're able to feed that production to a lot of cattle and a lot of pigs, but at the same time that we've got that really strong production. We want to have enough available for domestic needs. We're generally going to produce more that we need. They have the export markets in places as well. And so that's an important aspect that even in the middle of COVID, although we may not be traveling, you know, around the world to look at those markets, we need to make sure that we understand how those export markets come to bear for all of our producers, whether it be an Iowa, Nebraska, Illinois.

Dirck Steimel: Jay livestock is especially cattle are big in Nebraska. How do the international markets look for livestock and meat exports?

Jay Rampy: Well, that's, that's been one of the bright spots this year in terms of ongoing growth in, in the export markets. And I agree wholeheartedly with what Mo both Mike and Sam said in regards to corn and soybeans, because obviously we're, we're keen on those commodities and exports as well. But Nebraska is the largest beef exporting state in the nation because we have this such a big processing sector in our state and not only beef products, but also the awful and the hides and skins and the like is as important to the state as well. And what I, when I look at more of the protein sector, the, the beef and the pork, I look more in Asia and what's happening there because our biggest markets are over there. We've got Japan, South Korea, Vietnam, and of course, China China's not so big on the beef side right now. We'll try trying to grow that market. We just got some access to it over the last couple of years, but obviously this year they've been, they've been really buying up a lot of our pork because of what Sam said earlier about the ASF and their pork production. And so they have really been in, in the, in the pork markets this year. And looking ahead to next year, if we can, if the economy can stabilize, we can get beyond this COVID for, for some of the protein sectors, I tend to look more at the underlying income, can get conditions, economic growth conditions, and the population growth in those countries, because as they grow and to get more wealthy, they want to spend their disposable income on, on higher value foods and products. And that's where our meats come in. So, I think there's a tremendous amount of potential there. There, right now, it looks like we're going to finish this year with some uptick and some exports to those countries in overall, both in beef and pork, but and then next year, there's the projecting some potential growth there, because of there's a sense that we're going to get back to some sense of normalcy in terms of economic growth. We'll get through this, learn how to, to live with this COVID and adjust to it and, and adapt and move forward. And I think I was just watching a webinar yesterday on the processing sector and how they've learned to live. And I think that'll help us in retaining those export markets overseas and keeping the product flowing overseas.

Andrew Wheeler: We've already covered a lot of ground here, and that's just part one. We plan to release part two later this week where our esteemed economists will dive deeper into how farming is changing in their respective states and how COVID-19 has impacted the ag landscape over the past few months to listen in to part two, as well as part three of the series, be sure to subscribe to the Spokesman Speaks podcast in your favorite podcast app, and don't miss those episodes. And with that, we'll wrap up this episode of the podcast. We truly appreciate all of you for tuning in including our neighbors from Nebraska and Illinois. Thank you for doing the work that strengthens agriculture across the Midwest and throughout the entire country. And thanks for listening to the Spokesman Speaks.

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